Additional Lanterns

Additional Lanterns

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[Feature] Latest update missing items? and recipe/compat suggestions

Ultimushadow opened this issue Β· 11 comments

commented

Hey there, the 1.1.0 update was awesome, I found some things that might interest you to hear about though!

Firstly, for the update, I noticed the Mossy Cobble, Iron, and Netherite sets were all missing chains (or at least didn't load in my world)
Everything else seems to work fine though, I imagine with the mod already utilizing the block textures and the previously made colored lantern textures this is a pretty easy generation to run through

For some suggestions, I have a couple relating to recipes and the creative inventory tab
So, tab first, I don't know if this is just my game (Fabric 1.20.1) but the blocks are all loaded in a wildly random order which made finding all the blocks I wanted to look at a maaaajor pain in the ass, while it isn't a super big deal I was wondering if you could through everything into some kind of sorting so that it fills out in a more uniform way, preferably by material, then chain and undyed lantern, then white-black, red-pink, that way everything is laid out nice and neat

As for the recipes, some of these lanterns are wildly expensive compared to others
If we go off base lantern recipe, one lantern takes less than a single ingot of iron to craft. I noticed you had the gold lantern follow that pattern since it also has nuggets in the base game, but it gets progressively more expensive as you move to blocks and the other materials. Personally, if you aren't going to implement your own nuggets, I think you could get away with making the resource lanterns craft 4 instead of 1 to get that number of lanterns per ingot closer to the traditional lantern. The way most people use lanterns for decoration, you could end up going through an insane amount of resources. I would also extend this to quartz, amethyst, purpur, prismarine and bone lanterns.

The block lanterns are an interesting challenge as well. Since we have things like brick lanterns, some of them have sub-materials to make the lanterns while others use full blocks - which means similar blocks can have wildly different resource amounts. It's four nether brick items for a nether brick lantern, but four red nether brick blocks (each of which costs two bricks and two nether warts) for a single red nether brick lantern. My recommendation would be that the brick items get used similar to the resources (4 items -> 4 lanterns) and the blocks produce more or use less, either 2 blocks -> 8 lanterns or 4 blocks -> 16 lanterns, which sounds like a lot until you realize that a single block of iron should be able to make 10 lanterns so using 4 would give you 40.

The chain recipes are kind of all over the place too, blocks like deepslate bricks give 8, while Blackstone only gives 4, recipes like amethyst give 6 using a block as well as items but purpur does that too and only gives 4, meanwhile the base cost of a vanilla chain is just a little over 1 ingot but gold chain which uses a similar recipe gives 6. I think you could change the vanilla recipe to output 6 like your gold recipe and equate from there, that means each ingot is worth closer to 4-5 chains. Things like diamond would move to 15 chains then, but you could also just round it for an even 16 to fit in with the base 2, the blocks could give something like 20-24, since I imagine if someone is using the chains they are going to need more chains than lanterns it makes sense for it to be a little cheaper I think.
Of course, this can all be modified via datapack which is what I'll be doing in the meantime/if this isn't something you're interested in, so I could always post the recipe changes and they could be implemented separately if you feel the base recipes are good enough already.

Lastly, a couple mod interactions I wanted to mention:
When playing with the mod Supplementaries, all lantern blocks are able to be placed on walls, which gives them a little frame to hold the lantern. I'm not sure to what extent the frame can be modified by you but I do know that there's a way to give them unique textures (the default one just has the vanilla lantern colors). I imagine generating textures for these based off their respective blocks wouldn't be too bad though if you do find a way.

There's a mod which allows fenceposts to be linked together called Connectible Chains, which allows modded chains to be added using a simple item name input, and it looks for that name in both the block and item texture folders of the mod id - the block texture gets used for the length of the chain and the item texture gets used to make the "knot" that appears on the fence post. I ran into some issues adding chains from this mod because the way you've added them is purely the block texture which appears in a different directory, so I went through and added my own modified from the block texture assets in this mod. I think the easiest fix for this would be to generate the 2d item texture files and actually, giving the players a config option to toggle between 2d/3d textures for your items would be a great addition as some people may prefer one over the other. I'm not quite sure how that will work with your existing system though, let me know what you think!

Big ole paragraphs aside, great mod, I really enjoy the variety and will be using these in plenty of builds. Thanks again for your work on it!

commented

The OP's original comment re: recipes being all over the place was valid but IMO it's swung way too far in the opposite direction. 12 lanterns for 1 torch and 4 pieces of cobblestone is comically generous, I legit found this thread because I came here to report it as a possible bug. I recognize no one is handwringing over torch availability/balance but right now all the common stone lanterns are basically just a torch duping scheme.

IMO the # of torches required should match the # of lanterns outputted, regardless of how you choose to balance the rest of the resource requirements.

commented

With all due respect, I think that point of view is obsolete
There's no reason that decor needs to be a pain in the ass to acquire, which is the point of this mod. I can buy 400 lanterns from my villagers with literally no investment other than my pre-existing set up for enchantments, so cheap lighting isn't exactly new either
I actually make the case that the default lantern recipe is too expensive. It takes a whole iron ingot, for a torch that you can place on the ceiling instead of the wall.
Torches are cheap. Lighting in general is pretty cheap, granted some of them take some investment, but it's not like lighting is a super strategic resource in the game. Easy food, xp, high value items, that's definitely a line not to cross but I don't think I want to spend 4 blocks of anything for a single lighting block, that's unnecessary and bad game design imo
I think a middle ground would be to give an amount of lanterns that correlates to the value of the item it's crafting. Cobblestone may be a case where it should give 2-4 lanterns, but if one stick + one coal = 4 lighting blocks, combining that with say an iron ingot should not yield literally zero gain in blocks, that's just bad game design

commented

I'm not saying it should only give one, I agree that's ridiculous. I'm saying it should correspond to the output of the recipe. For instance, the current cobblestone lantern recipe is: 4 cobble + 1 torch = 12 lanterns. I think it should be 4 cobble + 4 torches = 4 lanterns, but I wouldn't be really opposed to a minor increase in overall "lighting power" or whatever (to your point re: "zero gain") if it was like 4 cobble + 4 torches = 6 lanterns or something like that.

I also agree that the vanilla lantern recipe is far too expensive, no argument here.

Like I said I realize this isn't an enormous overall balance concern (for all the reasons you mentioned), I just think the level it's at right now is silly.

EDIT: Heck I wouldn't even throw a fit over 4 cobble + 12 torches = 12 lanterns, it's just that the current implementation of giving you an 8–12 fold increase in lighting sources for 4 pieces of some common stone and some minor inconvenience when placing them just doesn't sit right with me.

commented

Thanks for the great feedback, I appreciate it! Most of the changes I list here are available in version 1.1.1.

Creative tab ordering

So, tab first, I don't know if this is just my game (Fabric 1.20.1) but the blocks are all loaded in a wildly random order

In Minecraft 1.19.3 the way items are added to creative tabs got changed which resulted in this behavior. Before 1.19.3 everything was added in the order the items were registered in. Now it appears to be random, I am not entirely sure how the order is established. It is probably something I will have to look into and fix through my core library at some point.
For now I've added a function to manually add the items to the tab in a specific order which at least resolves it for Additional Lanterns.

Missing chains

I noticed the Mossy Cobble, Iron, and Netherite sets were all missing chains

Whoops, the missing chains for mossy cobblestone and netherite are probably an oversight from me copy-pasting a line which did not have chains. The chains for iron are intentionally missing because I didn't really know how to do the recipe as the vanilla chains are also made of iron.

Lantern recipes

I think you could get away with making the resource lanterns craft 4 instead of 1

That is an excellent idea. I did feel like some of them were expensive but as there weren't any smaller/cheaper items for a lot of these materials, I thought it was good enough (although that did become a bit more of an issue by adding things like netherite and diamond).
I have now changed most of the recipes using full blocks to result in 12 lanterns rather than 1. Not sure why, but I felt like 16 light sources seems like a lot for a recipe with 1 torch and 12 just seemed a bit better πŸ˜›The two exceptions are crimson and warped planks which will result in 8 lanterns. Most of the items now result in 4 lanterns. The diamond, emerald, and netherite recipes result in 8 lanterns as these ingredients are significantly more expensive than most of the others.

Chain recipes

The chain recipes are kind of all over the place too

Fixed now, 3 blocks will give 16, block + 2 items will give 8, 3 items will give 4, and item + 2 nuggets gives 1. This does mean 3 blocks in the chain recipe gives more items than 4 blocks in the lantern recipe, but I think that is fine as a lantern also looks larger than a chain.

Mod compatibility

Supplementaries: I am not entirely sure what you mean. I believe Supplementaries already adds compatibility for Additional Lanterns, so all of Additional Lanterns' lanterns should just be placeable on walls.

Connectible Chains: I don't like the idea of adding an option for alternative 2d textures. Nearly all players just use whatever is the default, so most options just result in wasted effort. I did look into Connectible Chains to see if I could just add compatibility for it, however it seems they don't have any api for other mods to interact with and it also seems that Connectible Chains is only available for a few of the Minecraft versions supported by Additional Lanterns. This means it becomes more of a hassle for me to maintain Additional Lanterns as the differences between branches become more significant and also that any compatibility might break whenever they change their code resulting in me having to update Additional Lanterns.

commented

Ah, I've found the Supplementaries texture information, it's on here under the section "Texture Pack", second bullet point mentioning wall lantern models!

https://github.com/MehVahdJukaar/Supplementaries/wiki/Customization#texture-pack

commented

Wow you work fast, thanks for taking a look at things!

Yeah the creative tab was something I wasn't sure about, kind of obnoxious it no longer adds them as they're registered, thanks for taking the time to fix that!

For the Iron Chain, you could add a recipe where the nuggets and ingot switch, ie two ingots with a nugget in between, that way it's distinct from the vanilla chain without too much additional cost.

Lantern and chain recipe changes look great!

So, for Supplementaries, the items are placeable on walls already, that functionality works just fine! The attachment to the wall has it's own texture that can be modified though, which I figured I would suggest since that kind of change fits the vibe of this mod's goals. Here's an example, from left to right, with the vanilla lantern using the default texture, a gold lantern with a gold hanger, a copper lantern with a copper hanger, a paper lantern with a wooden hanger, and a quartz lantern which uses the default hanger.

2023-08-01_17 35 30

As for the Connectible Chains, I totally understand, in that case if it's not too much trouble could you generate some chain textures that have the "item" style, so it can be more easily added? If not, no worries, I made all of the chains from the 1.0.4 version of the mod with their textures myself so I can definitely just go and do that for the rest of them, it just takes a bit of work to manually alter the textures. I've attached the resources I used to make the mods work together for the 1.0.4 update so you can see what I needed to do, and will add the 1.1.0/1.1.1 items and textures once I hear back from you!

Additional-Lanterns-1.0.4-Connectible-Chains-Datapack.zip
Additional-Lanterns-1.0.4-Connectible-Chain-Textures.zip

Thanks again for the work, chains and lanterns are a great building tool!

commented

Hi, @Ultimushadow. I couldn't find an another way of contacting you so i'm posting this here.
I'm making a modpack and this Connectible Chains compatibility data+resourcepack would make my life a bit easier, but I dont know if i can include them.

Additional-Lanterns-1.0.4-Connectible-Chains-Datapack.zip
Additional-Lanterns-1.0.4-Connectible-Chain-Textures.zip

  • Do you plan releasing these two files on modrinth?
  • How would the licensing work? Isn't this resource pack in violation of Additional Lanterns's ARR license?
commented

Isn't this resource pack in violation of Additional Lanterns's ARR license?

I don't mind πŸ™‚

commented

I'll be honest I'm the last person to ask about licensing, I didn't plan on posting anything officially but I would be okay with finishing the pack with the rest of the 1.1.1 items and having SuperMartijn642 post them
If it's okay for me to post them though, let me know what all I should include in there so I'm not stepping on any toes!

commented

That's a fair point, unfortunately given Minecraft's mechanics it seems unlikely to implement, and even the 4+4 to 6 may look a bit silly

I wonder then if, for aesthetic and balance reasons, it may be worth making a whole new crafting station, which could then do exactly what you're looking for. Since all the current recipes are based on the vanilla recipe and share the aesthetic in the crafting table, moving them to another station could get around that. Then, you just determine the material you want items of, you put in the number of torches that material will convert, and get your lanterns out. Input one cobblestone block, 2 torches and get 3 lanterns out. Insert a netherite ingot, 16 torches, get 24 lanterns out. This way, the material will loosely correspond to how actually valuable it is, and you aren't paying materials for just changing a texture (for the quick example there that's just a flat 50% bonus in lighting objects, but it would probably work better on an exponential system. I would say using something like diamond should give you more than just a few torches).

Unfortunately, I do think that an entirely new system like this would just be too much work, trying to use the vanilla system would be rough with the range of value in the ingredients, and while the recipes as they are may be overtuned to the point of basically lighting duplication, I think the more convenient solution is for you to just tweak the recipe yourself with a datapack,

commented

Revisiting a couple old reports, any particular reason this suggestion thread is still open? Are there any individual features you're still looking to add, and if so would you like me to make a separate thread so this giant list can get cut down for easier reading?