[🐞]: Supplementaries incompatible with Create 0.5.1.j
Closed this issue · 10 comments
Edit:
Supplementaries made changes that broke compatibility with versions prior to 6.x of Create.
Nowhere is this documented, leaving users to guess which of the latest versions predate this change.
This in particular causes issues for users who allowed mod managers to update their mods.
Supplementaries does not list an incompatibility in any relevant changelog, nor a requirement of 6.0 in a way (not even as an optional) that mod sites can recognize - a feature commonly taken advantage of on sites like Curse and Modrinth in particular.
This is problematic in particular for those trying to manage a server modpack. Create's big leap in changes from 5.x to 6.x has left a gap in support among the Create community, meaning some core addons have yet to update forcing modpackers to remain on the older Create version until updates are made, lest they break the modpack entirely.
A simple mention of this in a changelog would have avoided confusion and helped find an appropriate version predating this issue, without having to resort to trial and error, loading each latest version until one was found that didn't refuse to load.
Before Continuing:
- Check you are using the latest version of the mods and its dependencies
- Always include a latest.log if you are crashing
- Remove mod that enhances Minecraft: Optifine, Sodium, others. The issue persists.
- If you are unsure which mod is the culprit.
Disable all of your mods and enable them 1-2 mods each time to isolate the culprit - Confirm that there is no existing issue with a similar description submitted in the list of issues.
Version
1.20.1-FORGE
Supplementaries Version
3.1.29
Moonlight Lib Version
1.20-2.14.0-forge
Describe Issue
Not to be confused with issue #1450
Supplementaries causes dependency related crash, stating incompatibility with Create 0.5.1.j
Observation:
Examining the mod files and the modpage, Supplementaries is:
- not listed as a Create mod, nor is Create mentioned
- does not list Create as a dependency on it's mod page on Modrinth or Curseforge
- does not list supported version of Create in any current or recent versions of Supplementaries on ModRinth or Curseforge
- does not list anything regarding Create in the mods.toml
The problem
There is no obvious way to foresee this dependency without triggering a crash, if the user is not using Create 6.0.0
Many users are still on 0.5.1.j or earlier due to early adoption phase of users and mod authors.
Dependencies should always be clearly noted.
No documentation of the dependency means users are left to brute force guess by downloading multiple versions until they find one that doesn't crash the game over the dependency.
Given that Create 6.0.0 is not listed as a hard dependency:
This may be the result of an indirect issue, where optional integration of Create 6.0.0 causes a non-graceful failure (crash), instead of ignoring the outdated version.
Recommendation
Update relevant sections of modpage, mods.toml and version uploads to treat this as a dependency on 6.0.0 for an optional features, or as a hard incompatibility with earlier versions.
This could help users find a version that will not fail to load, and avoid confusing users with a dependency crash in the absence of a hard dependency
or
add safeguard checks to check if an older version of Create is present. Have features dependent on Create 6.0.0 default to simpler non-dependent behaviors/features or disabled them entirely.
Just an update, I went through the various 1.20.1 versions of Supplementaries to find when this issue first occurs.
Version 1.20-3.1.20 appears to be the earliest point where problems occur. In this version, the game fails silently yet visibly. You get to the main menu, but the UI is corrupted to the point you can't even read anything. A warning toast appears to trigger, but all you can see are squares.
1.20-3.1.17 appears to be the latest 'safe' version where Supplementaries doesn't either crash or corrupt the UI when Create 0.5.1j is loaded.
that is not a crash.that is the mod informing you that it depends on create latest version which you failed to install. Closing as you arent using latest mods
and as a way to forsee it is precisely that. you boot up the game and the game nicely sends you amessage informing you of the dependency. If it was done wrong without a dependency set you would have seen a nice cash of the game, no nice error screen.
Idont need to upate mods.toml because that is precisely where the dependency that you see on that very message is aleady declared
It works in a "fails softly" kind of way, atleast. Sure.
I'd understand if I was dealing with a create add-on here, but last I looked - Supplementaries wasn't described as a mod for Create.
Point in fact, looking at the next update you made for 1.20.1, version 3.1.24, you had this to say
"no changes rebuilt jar since last update mixins decided not to generate a refmap..."
Why don't you note a change in requirements? You listed Moonlight just fine.
You made no mention of breaking compatibility with any version of any mod here, "no changes" just "rebuilt jar"
And you don't see why there's confusion here? It's because you didn't document it, but I guess I'll go dig through every version of every modloader just to see if maybe I missed it, given I only see ones for Forge on 1.20.1 out of Modrinth.
Like I get it, 6.0 made major changes, and you no doubt added support for them. I'm not here about that.
I'm here about the lack of documentation on this change, and the only way to know about it is to have a soft fail when I boot the game.
Sure would be great to know so I can bridge the gap from "oh, this mod now needs some new depency" and "what is the latest version that doesn't have that dependency, my modpack relies on mods not yet ready for Create 6.0"
You added a dependency at a seemingly random update and none of your changelogs on Modrinth or Curse seem to denote this change - just one day "woop sorry, I require a whole tech mod to function now"
Edit: I went and looked. No where do I see this being documented.
Sorry if me trying to be helpful came off as rude, but I genuinely suggested the .toml because I thought sites like Modrinth and Curse would read it to update a given versions dependencies; that maybe there was in issue where the sites weren't picking this up and that is why your mod wasn't showing this change in dependency.
Apparently not.
Noted.
So I guess update this issue to be "Supplementaries has undocumented changes to dependencies, which are not reflected on either mod page. Changelog summary does not mention this."
oh god what a wall of text. Dude its simple. just keep your mods updated.
Also back in my days people would get point for adding compat stuff. Aparenly nowdays people want more modders that work in a box. Supppementaries has soft compat with 30+ mods. Just look at its dependencies in file section. Most are minor or stuff to make stff better. all create stuff for example is movement behaviors for its blocks or display link integration
Dude it's simple:
Document these changes.
It's what a changelog is for.
You can't call it a 'soft compat' if the mod refuses to work with a specific version. That is literally the definition of a hard incompatibility.
So again, not asking you to support everything under the sun. I was pointing out that you didn't document the changes. It can't take you that long to note "no longer works with versions of Create older than 6.0' in the change log.
You even wrote a changelog, it was simply misleading.
No one else had an issue doing that with their mods. But you cop an attitude over it
Let me put it like this:
One extra line in your change log after you made this change.
That would have saved you from taking time out of your day to talk to idiots like me about something like this.
they are documented, in the changelogs of some file. should be written "updated create compat" or similar. I dont deny that an updated of those might have slipped if a mod update had many other changes on same day, but i try to docuent stuff in the changelogs. shouldbe around same time that the new patch came out.
As for soft dependencies these are listed in a file dependencies section.
Oh and by definition it is a soft compat. it doesnt require the mod to run. The way soft compat works is that its class loading behind a mod id check. It is impossible to support 2 different versions at the same time. That assumes that the mod is latest version which it should always is. People should always keep their mods updated.
If they dont then its their problem as they are using outdated and unsupported versions.
The issue as it stands is that you poorly documented a hard incompatibility. All you had to do was mention it in the changelog. Go back and edit it if you want, but at the time I wrote this issue, you had made zero mention of this.
Instead of copping an attitude with me, you could have written literally a single line to the changelog saying "From this version onwards, not compatible with Create <6.0"
Generally I'd agree about keeping mods up to date.
Problem is, 6.0 broke basically everything, especially due to what they changed in Flywheel. This affected not only Create addons, but shaders, performance mods and more. You aren't just arguing 'be up to date if you want my mod' but 'remove all those other mods if you want my supplements"; including big feature mods people are demanding because Youtubers are still featuring them in their videos.
Using 6.0 right now, means sacrificing shader performance (incompatibility with entity instancing), physics simulations (same as with shaders), mods like Eureka!, Clockwork, Trackwork, Vaklyrien Skies 2....
Modpacks are adjusting sure, but again. All I needed to know is which of the mods was still compatible with 0.5.x versions of create.
You couldn't even mention that.
You apparently expect people to instead dig around in the jar file, because you won't make use of the multiple ways Modrinth and Curseforge allow us to communicate the same things in plaint text for users.
Your changelogs are so vague and lacking in details, I don't even know why you bothered to type them.
That's all I'm going to say on this, I'm tired of discussing this with you. Good day.
